To find out that who you thought was your partner actually had no interest or ability to play that role. He is so good with her, and loves him just as much as he loves herand I hate to give up on him because I believe there is a really good man in there, I am just trying to reach him. What do I do about the kids? Aue, what to do when theres a little one involved? They will say that you are the angry one and that you need help,and walk away full of selfrighteousness. Most of our issues now revolve around money. Right now we are working on trust, and honesty to build that trust. How to Stay with a Narcissist - Psych Central The most important factor in this seems to be TRUST. He has been a major womanizer and into porno all my married life. It needs to flap its wings until blood flows to each vien in order to escape the cocoon. Word salads and nonsensical conversations . Never be afraid of the consequences they (Nar) will have to suffer for their own faulty decisions, it will only help them. Hi Pamela and welcome (-: Empathy is not going to help him but him coming face to face with reality will. Getting my narcissist significant other to be accountable will never happen. Butterfly is my chosen name because if you help a catteiller out of its cocoon it will die. He never did anything for me nothing. The reason i fall for these men? None of this is worth staying with a Narcissist. If he begins to blame anyone else or confabulate you need to be ready to end the conversation very confidently and remain calm and in control of yourself. I know I have the strength to give him more than I expect to get from him. To me he is like a predator sucking the happiness out of his prey and then throwing them away when they are sad. So unless youve got some ideas I dont know what to do except to talk to our doctor and see if they have any ideas that might help., I cant be late for work again and so I am sorry I cant drop you off today., I dont know how to handle you when you get so angry at me, and so from now on I am going to need to get someone who knows know how to handle angry people (the police?) They changed my attitude not his right away.. He goes overboard with some of this stuff. 5 Powerful Boundaries To Counter Passive-Aggressive Narcissists Ive now found myself again, and this website. It used to be about 70%, and in the remaining 30% he would seem normal and nice. I tried to help someone that I thought I cared about every day for a year and in the end, I ended up trying to hold on to her to the point where she consciously decided she would blatantly lie to the police about any contact, even coincidental, which resulted in me being arrested for STALKING her even though my contacts with her consisted of 5 phone calls none of which consisted of anything but the question why? 12) While driving the old car you locked yourself out one day and violently damaged the car trying to break into it causing hundreds of dollars of damage, instead of calling me to give you a spare key or calling a locksmith. There is NOTHING you can do and even attempting to manage is not worth the headache and most times doesnt work anyways. How To Break Up With Someone Toxic/Narcissistic Safely - And Never Look You ask the same questions that I want answered. That way I dont react if he adversely reacts. He was agressive in subtile ways, ignoring me, humiliating me, always complaining about the things that were not good about me, telling me to put on other clothes if we went to freinds.. and so on. Keep in mind that you earn more than I do and that I am raising two children. At this point though I would like to create a boundary and consequences for his going for drinks afterwards at a very late hour which I find inappropriate and creates a cycle of sleep deprivation and more NPD actions for long periods of time. The only way to reach someone like this is through the pain of consequence. Here are some "habits" people have after growing up with a narcissistic parent: 1. So conclusion I dont think its wise to ask them would they feel more comfortable getting help from somebody else to help with the situation as they see this as a threat and if they are truly narcissistic they dont think they need help with anything. Kim first let me say thank you for being the only voice that says it is possible to stay with a Narc I ordered Back from the Looking Glass I was hiding it as I was reading it but he found it and boy was he livid to put it mildly after being subjected to a horrible rage episode I put it down for a while and felt a bit hopelessIll spare you all the gory details weve all heard them before but my breaking point came when he put my son out (who suffers from depression) and I told him I would be leaving also but that I would come back on weekends I just needed to be able to think clearly while not being subjected to his tyranny under the same roof with him everyday. I know its not funny, but I know why the sales agent hung up. thanks!! i cant see them. I saw that and I used that knowledge to my advantage. Kim, you also say about leaving accountability to others. Is it OK to do this? I understand the need of getting these things off your chest. Kim, in response No. Sorry I dont have much time tonight please visit the page here , http://www.narcissismcured.com/12_Steps_to_End_the_Fights.html. I dont change easily, to say the least, but, I always enjoy what you teach. I have just stood by and finally let it all happen to him. I just got served with a baseless lawsuit by him and now have to find a pro bono attorney as I have no money but with his slick attorney ways, he will someone win even though CPS has said he cant see the kids unsupervised but the courts are allowing him to file suit for custody?? One of the big problems for me, is my own sarcasm of others, when it comes to this sickness. It was all my fault she says because I crossed the line but she didnt do anything wrong. Living with individuals with NPD means accepting the facts of 1) being the only adult in the relationship and 2) giving empathy and recieving empathy. Apologies, crying baby, spelling mistakes and unfinished sentences above. Marie, sorry to hear. Also as far as a male role model he has blamed all the men at our church for our problems and we are now going to a different church whice actually has much older and stronger marriages, but will this work with someone he doesnt know very well to hold him accountable? 12 Amber Lives in Leeds, West Yorkshire, UK Author has 78 answers and 30.8K answer views 2 y Related Is there anything more I can do bridge the gap? However if they perceive that they do not need you to feel secure and happy you had better find a way to get out quickly because they have no incentive to check their behaviour. I just dont know how to hold her accountable in a way that will WORKand not just make things worse. 6) You gifted me a pair of boots and then pawned them without telling me, when you needed money. If money is borrowed I have to ask him to please find a way to make his own money through employment. Hi Genelle and welcome (-: There are exercises to deal with this type of behaviour in the chapter on limiting abuse in The Love Safety Net Workbook. Great information! I know how painful this feels. It took me quite some time catching up on reading all of the comments. Forever taking and never giving. And if you know you are with a narcissist? Trying to be honest? He broke up with her and I am so glad but she wont move on. They strike back hard to try to save their own self or credibility. Just last night he tried to manipulate me again into lending him more money by setting the stage thru being super sweet cooking and cleaning and then bamm, here he goes again. No matter how soul destroying this type of relationship can be, your experience of this disorder being incurable is not ours and the DSM has also recently been updated to change their position on this. Him. My husband asked for a divorce November 2012 and we are in the process. Hes still with her (and who knows who else!) It went from serious concern about his behaviors to the police belittling my call for help (we are not here to solve your relationship problems) and the mental health services deciding Im disturbed and needed to be put in hospital against my will to give me a break from my husband. You do not *ever* talk to a doctor about someone else without their permission, and you do not respectfully obtain permission by stating what you are going to need to do.. Ohhh my God- I wish I had found this website and this article in the early stages of my marriage. Hes always telling me how to run my life, deal with my kids etc yet I cannot speak to him about any issues he has.Im supposed to be the good wife, just be there, just listen etc and if Im having a problem and hes got the time hes all ears and all opinions (un wanted opinions too) yet when he wants to hear none of it, he has too much on his mind already, he has no time for the crap he becomes hurtful and nastyhes like a jekyll and hydeloving and caring one minute dont bother me with this crap other timesI feel so confused and tired of walking on eggshells and I could write novels about all the different things he gets mad about but I am never ever to be upset with himhe always has a way to defend his actions or justify themHe should have been a lawyer. Kim, thank you for taking a leadership role and sharing with us what worked for you! Dear Michelle, (Comment 48) If this is your first time seeing my face o. You can't hold narcissists accountable; you just invite embittered counterattack. I would really appreciate any input. I had to get over my embarrassment of ever tolerating or choosing this deranged fool for a partner, how ridiculous. Only within the last couple of years did I start studying manipulation techniques for something unrelated. The first time my son met him he said that man is bipolar and several other people said that about him. Just dont make your kids suffer cause you love him and dont want to be alone!! I am constantly lowering my expectations but I wont compromise my safety,tranquility and emotional stability. I dont want my children to be like him. He wants him to be loved under all the pain my friend feels. 8 Things That Can Trap You in a Relationship With a Narcissist - Insider He makes real good money but tells me he works his ass off for me because I quit my job and hurt us. here to come and talk to you when you get angry. Will he ever understand what he did was wrong? You asked me to lend you the money to pay it off knowing that I made some money on the sale of my house, granted I did not have a new job yet after leaving my old one to move and am a single mom of two. He would feel bad for actions, shameful even and would replace, apologize or do what he could to help resolve the issue for me that hurt me. and after everything they do we still crying for them?- there must be some personality traits that mirror ours. I dont want them to be the victim or the perpetrator. I have pictures, clear pictures to prove it. My advice if you are in a relationship with a nar, get out and dont let them manipulate you back in. I wish my thinking was as clear as yours, but its not. 3 Set boundaries to protect yourself. I tried so hard and have read all your ebooks but nothing worked until i have just said enough is enough. The Narcissist's Evasive Tactics - Mental Health Matters Cofe But now, we are looking at the possibility of him losing his business and losing out home. Don't fall for the temptation to sink to their level. I also bought the codependency book. It was my word against hers. Co-Parenting with a Borderline: Being the Asshole, Part 3 But when I wasnt getting what he said he got totally and completely frustrated with me, said he didnt have time for this crap in his day so I offered to call her back and handle it and he refused said he would call. I thought that maybe I missed reading something. When I get criticism,shouting verbal abuse , for no apparent reason , I know its not me ,just him not able to process He hides these lovely attributes in certain company people he wants to impress and/or people he craves admiration from. Stay calm and polite no matter how they react. Its all straight from the heart and tells it like it really is. And it went too far once, already, he has had an affair. them, promoting a sturdy stance for (empathically) holding the narcissist accountable. You are right on target. He started calling another woman before he left. I thought he was the love of my life!! Through this Blog it has become to Clear. The letter should be very matter of fact and unemotional and only stress your concern about him. I was shocked. In my marriage, I only said something when I was pushed to the wall and was accused of being the one at fault because he was perfectly happy in the marriage. The Accountable Narcissist | HealthyPlace (they seem to have a hard time understanding the grief I am experiencing, for starters!). I had terrible abandonment issues from my childhood and bereavements and his scared child behaviour never helped. Finally understanding that my relationship with my mother was actually a relationship with a narcissist was the key to the rest of my life. He told me yesterday that he was changing phone carriers because the sales agent hung up the phone on him and he thought that was rude. Have we had good times? How to hold a Narcissist accountable.Holding a Narcissist I constantly remind myself of this. Kim, Speak clearly and concisely to make them understand you. He drew me back in, and then I found out at the same time he was softening me up and I was letting down my guard he was seeing and sleeping with an ex-girlfriend! But God, do I miss the good. This is often referred to as "love bombing." 1. This is indeed, a difficult road to travel. He does not know how to be himself as a child so when he has questions and here is the hard part for me to remember, he really doesnt know beyond the child age he is. I think however there are differences in people with npd. After twenty-eight years of this, I feel used up and find it difficult to persevere. Thank you Kim and Steve for your inspirational insights Im trying to hang in there!!!! So..I learned alot because of this horrid person and a few others, and i will never repeat that kind of stupidity. When bubs doesnt sleep and I get a little touchy when he wakes, he go he goes back to bed, I later discover hes gone home and I cop the blame for making him feel unwelcome! (exhausted). I was going to divorce him and he asked for forgiveness and a second chance it was good for a month but he couldnt keep it up and now 7 months later I am telling him I want a divorce our eclesiastical leader is helping he hopes to heal our marraige But I feel my N is immovable to compromise. The good thing I have taken care of many members but most of all this is how I have withstand being married to a man like this for this long. Im hoping to share and hear more with everyone. Trying to hide the truth, trying to avoid real intimacy? He most recently climbed in window, in middle of the night-sometime before 4a.m. The guy Im living with even wrote 2 books and the first one he is actually describing the messiah (him). The key element here is that I always know when he has started to break that trust, because out of the blue with no reason at all, my NPD starts treating me very poorly, acts evasive etc. I moved to Minnesota to help her because she is 70 now and had rotator cuff surgery. Surprise him to a treat and see how he responds, put some spice into your lives, take the initiative and action to turn the relationship around. Im at a loss. Hi Lady Jane, you may want that sure but selfish people arent prone to listening! Sometimes, the best way to hold a narcissist accountable is to take the proverbial bull by the horns and directly, and (unwaveringly) address their behavior. I did and you talked to her on her birthday and I was so glad you made her feel loved. He instantly claimed he did nothing wrong and tried to act like they were against both of us. Just a quick note to let you know that reading your material (every bit of it) and then putting it into practice has changed my marriage. They can tell you anything to make you feel sorry for them, sometimes when they do get it, they even apologize: but, so soon they repeat, rendering the apology useless. Thanks everybody for sharing. Especially the magic scissors and self-soothing are very powerful skills. After another long fight, I agreed to add it to your tab and for you to pay it back with your monthly payments. I do love him. The narcissist's inability to act conscientiously in a relationship illuminates his or her lack of empathy. I dont want my children to marry a person like him. Thankfully I never had to suffer that but mental and emotional stuff can leave scars just as deep. Everyone loves him.minus his employees. Loss of supply - crying for themselves because they've lost a valuable source of supply. You are correct that there is no point in arguing but that does not mean he will never understand it was wrong. Neg hitting, a compliment followed by a slight insult, is one of his favourites. Very spiritual, as well. Questions upon questions, leading to more unanswered questions. 9. ThaNK YOU. Hold them accountable Stop letting them slide with their bad behavior. Knowing you got paid in the mean time and you lied straight in my face and told me yeah I bought her the doll she wanted Then when I talked to your ex-wife wishing your daughter a happy birthday asking if she liked the present you sent her. Narcissistic behavior on the job can arise at any time, with troubling results. I often feel rejected and alone. Im hurting and I dont know what to do. And heal and grow. I have become physically ill from this(lungs). This is exactly why you need to step out of the way and let other professionals such as your doctor or the police deal with him. But really, I am just angry and hurt. He is a man who keeps running away from commitments , he is traumatized . I LOVE this article. Trust will start being built when your partner begins to see that you are capable of protecting your own interests and that you are not scared of doing what you need to do to stand up for yourself calmly and with deliberation without abandoning them or using emotional manipulation to try and get your way. I hope someone might read this and be more careful about their childrens safety and will not go through the agony I have. So, in a way, it is a choice. Once you obtain that, the cloud hoovering overhead will become smaller and smaller the sense of freedom and relief will ease and bring peace to your heart, mind, soul, and with Kim & Steves teachings overcoming our own gap work will ease putting strong boundaries in place. Tanya and Genelle, My story is the same too :/. I switched tacks and did something close to what you described. Hey Hazel You really need to work through the 10 Steps to Overcome Codependence and The Love Safety Net Workbook. Steve did get very enraged when I first started setting boundaries but as it was about what I would not live with for myself rather than me putting myself above him there was still room for him to come down out of his ivory tower and be with me once the corner he had painted himself into had become too uncomfortable. One clear warning of what will result if their behaviour continues and then action. But that makes it no less hurtful and no less difficult to accept how she simply trashed our hopes and dreams together. That means I do as much as possible to surround myself with loving people, things I like to do, and time for myself to process everything in my life. I think the marriage is dead. And I am practicing to manage my own defence. I am so grateful for all the support I have received here in the USA and looking forward to passing on strength, compassion and support. It was only recently when trying to find out if the man I love is a pathological liar or not, that I tripped upon information on narcissism. Now we have to devide property, of course I dont deserve anything, I didnt do as I was told, had too much to say for myself, turned everyone against him and so it goes on and on. By respecting my emotional, mental, physical health, financials, relationships with others, mature consequence based choices..it became very easy to see, that at no point, was tolerating this persons selfish, cruel, abusive, irresponsible and dangerous bullsh*t, a correct choice in any way shape or form. I have been working on our attachment and his security to me before I say anything. He slandered her and he will slander me. We pretty much all do that but that just adds fuel to their fire and gives them more power.You are most likely a very special person and through your experiences will have developed qualities that some people may never have.To Kym and Steve, I propose a toast for being honest enough to share some very private and personal things so that others may be helped. Cuz hes made himself King? I did not understand how I was allowing others to have such unhealthy control over me. Whats the answer? Its hard to grasp how this man that professed his love so earnestly and regularly could turn this fast! I know a side of him that he can not hide from me, however the ugly side wins more often these days and so I reach for a new life with less turmoil and frustration. And our relation will be over, youll never see me again. Im a survivor. I actually separated from him once for a few months prior to the breakup for the same reasons constant verbal abuse and emotional manipulation Prince charming until any type of insecurity would arise. I have just left a 10yr relationship with a Narcissist and I feel physically and mentally exhausted. For years I thought eventually hed come back into my life. I met my friend over 30 years ago. I still cant bring myself to hate her, because I understand how her having this problem is probably not her own doing but that of her parent/s.. I would like to hear more about how to protect our 10-year-old son. Write in a journal, do something good for yourself. I really think that Kim & Steves ebooks Back From The Looking Glass and The Love Safety Net Workbooks would benefit you, even with the separation. 2 Say "no" when they ask for favors. Guess that is what still hurts him most. I guess he was held accountable for his choices and the natural consequences for his behavoir was the loss of his family. Any suggestion would be great NPD is a very child-like personality disorder, so it would behoove us to learn some child therapy techniques if were going to love and live with a Narcissist. After my split from my ex I met this guy from a dating website over year ago and thought I found my perfect soul mate Three months into the relationship things started to go really strange. A month ago he started calling me and emailing me telling me how much he loves me and wants to get back together. That it had nothing to do with me. My husband left me over a year ago. I have a friend who is a school teacher is going through something similiar with the principal. But I cant call the police, or the doctor, or even the priest, and say my husband said hed call me but he didnt and he got mad at me when I expected him to be sorry about that or My husband laughed at my idea like it was ridiculous. Me feeling of hurt on emotionally not feeling special. Never listens to a single word I say. Did he just not bond with me and I did with him and that is why this seems harder? Well I read almost everyones comments and I am glad I am not alone. During our twenty-eight years of marriage, my husbands manipulation has been very successful in keeping me from many relationships including family, both mine and his. Jackie, you hit it so head on. The other piece of this for me isI know that somewhere along the way, Im going to really NEED him for something. I was!!! Do what you can do and stop worrying about the rest, above all stop blaming yourself ! Can a Narcissist Change for Love? - Marriage Leopards never change their spots, they just get darker and he is up to all his old tricks and then some. I get it you want me out because I am of no use to you anymore He was very serious about making the change. It was days later that I discovered the truth after he got drunk and sent me my pics in a textsbut he of course had no idea how he got my pics??!!! I also know I hang onto him, at least by calling his answering machine almost every night once or twice because when I hear his voice mail greeting, I remember the good times between us, which were years ago and I dont have any replacements. Forget needing him to be sorry that is a losers game and only got things to where they are now. Then a few months later I found out from you ex-wife that you slept with her several times during the time you spent with her and your kids. The only thing you can do with a narcissist is get them out of your hair. If you want to reconnect with him and hes willing, its is going to take more work on your part than you ever imagined anybody should do for another. Mine came back after 8 years of doing what he wanted. He says what happened to you? A narcissist knows how to turn on the charm when they need to. Never her.Now after almost a year up here. Thank you! Everything that has been stated here is exactly what Ive been through. so many nights i wake up wondering what happened to my sweet man.. However, he continued to push and push to see if I would break.trying to get me to act as immature as he wouldso he wouldnt feel inferior.or at least cause me pain to ease his own. Its almost two years later, we are separate under the same roof until I can move out. You laid the facts straight out down the line without a hint of self-pity or confusion about your rights as an individual, or as a mother. Very simple. The only thing you can do, as I have see everyone noting, is that you just manipulate your surroundings to your sanity and survival. I was disappointed however, and stuck in my own issues, feeling like I gave and gave and wasnt getting much in the last couple of months we were living together. The link is as follows: http://www.mental-health-matters.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=167. Im still trying to recover my self esteem. The reality is they are not kings nor queens. If I apply your suggestions I am going to like myself and him better. The stress of this is hard and I have known him for a long time. I do believe he misses meand he loves me as much as he is able to love, but this disability is cyclicand I am much too aware of his cycles. I still get constant emails wishing me well and statements of regret and promises hoping Ill return someday. Later that day he comes home and tells me what a nice lady she is and he had a good conversation with herwait a minuteshe called him while he was busy at work, misinformed him saying it bounced, he gets all snappy with me and he calls her back all nice with an answer that I providedI feel like he is always the good guy with everyone else, never wants to look bad in front of anyone and yet I know the real him.